Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:07.400 --> 00:00:08.870
Welcome to myth makers.2 00:00:09.220 --> 00:00:13.910 Myth makers is the podcast for fantasy fans and fantasy creatives 3 00:00:13.910 --> 00:00:16.790 brought to you by the Oxford center for fantasy. 4 00:00:17.480 --> 00:00:21.110 My name is Julia Golding. I'm the director of the center, 5 00:00:21.110 --> 00:00:25.110 but I also spend most of my life being an author writing in many different 6 00:00:25.110 --> 00:00:26.830 genres for all different age groups, 7 00:00:27.290 --> 00:00:29.990 but very often returning to the genre of fantasy. 8 00:00:31.060 --> 00:00:34.390 I've been deeply inspired by talking all my writing life. 9 00:00:34.680 --> 00:00:37.990 So it was a great excitement that I saw that, uh, 10 00:00:37.990 --> 00:00:42.910 Amazon prime were making a serious based on the second age of talking. 11 00:00:43.850 --> 00:00:48.150 Now, the Oxford center for fantasy runs, creative courses, 12 00:00:48.730 --> 00:00:53.030 and the students have kept together after the courses to, uh, 13 00:00:53.140 --> 00:00:55.590 keep us a group of creative, supporting each other, 14 00:00:55.590 --> 00:00:57.630 a sort of modern form of inklings. 15 00:00:58.090 --> 00:01:02.190 And to mark the arrival of the Amazon series, 16 00:01:02.320 --> 00:01:05.990 we had a first reaction gathering where we could share our views. 17 00:01:06.600 --> 00:01:10.430 So if you want to listen to what fellow fans were thinking, 18 00:01:10.430 --> 00:01:15.190 please listen on because what we've done in this is first part of it is 19 00:01:15.260 --> 00:01:20.230 I explain where the material in the series seems to depart from 20 00:01:20.660 --> 00:01:25.190 what you would find in the sort of canonical, you know, talking material. 21 00:01:26.040 --> 00:01:26.390 Uh, 22 00:01:26.390 --> 00:01:30.510 so if you have wondered about that is a very brief guide about the differences 23 00:01:30.510 --> 00:01:33.030 between what you can find in the silver really, 24 00:01:33.030 --> 00:01:35.830 and the appendices and the Amazon series, 25 00:01:36.010 --> 00:01:40.830 but then you can listen to the views exchanged on what we made of the series. 26 00:01:41.250 --> 00:01:44.110 And perhaps you can also add in your own comments at the end, 27 00:01:44.110 --> 00:01:48.750 if you agree with us, we complete our discussion with our star rating. 28 00:01:48.960 --> 00:01:53.350 So stay tuned to find out if we think it's a hit or a miss, 29 00:01:53.990 --> 00:01:57.110 thank you very much and enjoy our discussion. 30 00:01:59.400 --> 00:02:00.080
So.31 00:02:00.080 --> 00:02:00.913
Um,32 00:02:02.760 --> 00:02:07.710 welcome everybody to the early reaction to the rings of power 33 00:02:07.980 --> 00:02:11.990 series based on, um, talking's material. 34 00:02:13.620 --> 00:02:18.150 What I'm going to do is I'm going to give you a little introduction just to say 35 00:02:19.100 --> 00:02:24.030 what they're doing in the story that is based 36 00:02:24.040 --> 00:02:26.910 on the appends, uh, 37 00:02:26.910 --> 00:02:31.590 and the Soin and where it differs in case you're interested in what 38 00:02:31.590 --> 00:02:35.830 what's going on. Um, only briefly, not, 39 00:02:35.830 --> 00:02:39.230 not absolutely to deep nerd level. Um, 40 00:02:39.290 --> 00:02:42.670 I'm BA there's bound to be YouTube videos out there about that, 41 00:02:42.770 --> 00:02:46.830 but I just give you the broad brush strokes of the kind of decisions they're 42 00:02:46.830 --> 00:02:49.670 making, which I thought was really fascinating. 43 00:02:50.450 --> 00:02:55.230 And then I was going to ask you for your reactions about in, 44 00:02:55.230 --> 00:02:58.590 in three areas. So have a think about this. 45 00:02:58.590 --> 00:03:03.320 The first one is your reactions to the story, you know, 46 00:03:03.320 --> 00:03:06.480 did you enjoy watching it the second, uh, 47 00:03:06.530 --> 00:03:10.690 is your reaction to the performance of the actors 48 00:03:11.730 --> 00:03:16.130 embodying these characters? And the last one is the creative realization of it, 49 00:03:16.590 --> 00:03:21.200 the special effects, the looks, the music and so on. 50 00:03:21.890 --> 00:03:25.280 So have a think, um, hopefully people will disagree. 51 00:03:25.890 --> 00:03:28.840 We don't all want to say, oh yes, it was wonderful or no, it was terrible. 52 00:03:29.010 --> 00:03:32.040 So it'd be, don't worry if you don't agree with other people. 53 00:03:32.040 --> 00:03:35.960 Cause that's what we want. We want discussion about it. So first of all, 54 00:03:35.960 --> 00:03:39.320 just to give you a sort little bit of background, um, 55 00:03:40.620 --> 00:03:44.880 you probably all know that the rights for talking material are, you know, 56 00:03:45.560 --> 00:03:47.720 Byzantine. Um, 57 00:03:48.130 --> 00:03:51.200 so they're only allowed to do certain things. 58 00:03:51.500 --> 00:03:54.520 And as I understand it, um, 59 00:03:54.520 --> 00:03:59.480 they've sort of got rights to second age material talking's world 60 00:04:00.250 --> 00:04:03.320 is described in well it's four ages, really? 61 00:04:03.320 --> 00:04:07.120 So the first stage is from the creation of, well, 62 00:04:07.590 --> 00:04:11.520 I suppose creation comes even before the first stage, but there's a creation. 63 00:04:11.710 --> 00:04:13.280 Then there's the first stage, 64 00:04:14.040 --> 00:04:17.680 which is really dominated by the, 65 00:04:17.680 --> 00:04:20.080 the silver Maril the silver reels, 66 00:04:20.080 --> 00:04:24.440 which are a jewel made by the elves and the wars about that 67 00:04:25.220 --> 00:04:26.920 and the defeat of the big, 68 00:04:26.920 --> 00:04:30.360 bad of the Mor who's a character called Morgo. 69 00:04:31.510 --> 00:04:35.960 Then once his defeated, then there's the second age. 70 00:04:35.960 --> 00:04:38.200 And this is where, uh, 71 00:04:38.200 --> 00:04:42.720 the rings of power sit and coming up 72 00:04:43.610 --> 00:04:47.400 is the captain Sarah who's like 73 00:04:48.100 --> 00:04:50.950 taking over and he's now the big Badie. 74 00:04:51.370 --> 00:04:54.710 And this is the age when, um, 75 00:04:56.150 --> 00:05:00.400 sort of ELs men and walls are all living alongside each other. 76 00:05:01.060 --> 00:05:02.080 And that age, 77 00:05:02.340 --> 00:05:07.240 age completes with the battle that you see at the start 78 00:05:07.650 --> 00:05:09.280 of the Lord of the rings films, 79 00:05:10.110 --> 00:05:13.640 when the ring is cut from the hand of sour, okay. 80 00:05:14.100 --> 00:05:16.600 The third age, which is very long, 81 00:05:16.600 --> 00:05:20.400 we only see the end of it in Lord of the rings is the age, 82 00:05:21.610 --> 00:05:22.443 um, 83 00:05:23.100 --> 00:05:27.690 of the rise and fall of Goor really with the hobbits kind of establish 84 00:05:27.870 --> 00:05:29.730 establishing themselves in the Shire. 85 00:05:30.190 --> 00:05:35.050 And that age ends when the ring is destroyed and 86 00:05:35.050 --> 00:05:39.600 we are sorted living in the fourth age. So that's, 87 00:05:39.600 --> 00:05:43.040 that's the kind of outline. So they've got the middle bit, 88 00:05:43.040 --> 00:05:47.600 they've got well middle, but they got the second age of that. Um, 89 00:05:48.250 --> 00:05:52.680 so they've obviously made the decision to follow 90 00:05:54.810 --> 00:05:58.520 a composite cast in the same way as you do in fellowship with the ring, 91 00:05:58.520 --> 00:06:00.440 but they're, they're starting with go. 92 00:06:01.460 --> 00:06:06.240 And the main things where this series works with the book 93 00:06:07.060 --> 00:06:10.000 and differs from the book, hang around that character. 94 00:06:11.160 --> 00:06:16.130 So if you've watched the first two episodes, you'll see, go is, 95 00:06:16.130 --> 00:06:20.970 is realized as a warrior who, 96 00:06:21.940 --> 00:06:23.210 um, is fighting, 97 00:06:23.300 --> 00:06:27.970 is basically aware of the returning evil and trying to persuade others that it's 98 00:06:27.970 --> 00:06:32.010 coming back. So yes, in talking's material, 99 00:06:32.520 --> 00:06:36.490 collateral does start over in valor. She's really, really old, 100 00:06:37.040 --> 00:06:41.010 really, really old already by the second age, which are kind of, 101 00:06:41.010 --> 00:06:43.530 cause the actress is so beautiful and young, young looking, 102 00:06:43.750 --> 00:06:46.570 but she's one of the oldest people around at the time, 103 00:06:47.430 --> 00:06:49.810 she was one of four children of who, 104 00:06:49.810 --> 00:06:54.660 one of those is her brother who appears at the beginning of the series. Um, 105 00:06:54.840 --> 00:06:59.300 her brother FINRA, he dies in one of the hidden kingdoms of the elves. 106 00:06:59.300 --> 00:07:00.780 Elves had these hidden kingdoms. 107 00:07:01.030 --> 00:07:05.790 He dies in Agathon as do her other two brothers die in other 108 00:07:05.790 --> 00:07:09.350 battles. So she does how she has seen death. That's true. 109 00:07:11.010 --> 00:07:14.950 But in terms of talking story, she's not this warrior figure. 110 00:07:15.690 --> 00:07:20.630 She spends most of the first age in a place called Doria alongside 111 00:07:20.630 --> 00:07:24.230 this figure called Milian. Who's like a bit like Gander's, 112 00:07:24.230 --> 00:07:28.600 she's a sort of Aang jewel type. It's not, that's not the right word, 113 00:07:28.600 --> 00:07:33.600 but she's kind of semi, semi divine. She's not quite normally, um, 114 00:07:33.600 --> 00:07:36.360 Elvin or human or anything. Um, 115 00:07:36.560 --> 00:07:39.240 she's not really junior to Gil. Gillad, 116 00:07:39.800 --> 00:07:43.800 who's the high king in terms of the talking version of this. 117 00:07:44.700 --> 00:07:49.220 And so she's not the sort of swash baling warrior that's been realized she does 118 00:07:49.220 --> 00:07:49.760 fight, 119 00:07:49.760 --> 00:07:54.300 but her fight is more like a leader deciding where the armies go rather than, 120 00:07:54.300 --> 00:07:58.460 rather than that rather elegant snow troll, um, moment, which I loved, 121 00:07:58.460 --> 00:08:03.360 but you know, she's not kind of in the, in the book. 122 00:08:04.250 --> 00:08:04.620 Um, 123 00:08:04.620 --> 00:08:08.600 and she of course has her mental warfare of having one of the rings to keep evil 124 00:08:08.600 --> 00:08:13.080 at bay. So she is a fighter, but just not quite the lovely warrior that we see. 125 00:08:14.130 --> 00:08:14.963 Um, 126 00:08:15.150 --> 00:08:20.040 it's also not mentioned that she's under a curse or a doom because the reason 127 00:08:20.040 --> 00:08:24.780 the LS end up in middle earth is because it's like a, 128 00:08:25.110 --> 00:08:28.250 um, it's a, there's a, 129 00:08:28.760 --> 00:08:33.250 a fight over the silver reels and they leave to go and reclaim them, 130 00:08:33.250 --> 00:08:37.730 but there's some kin laying that goes on. And so they're under a, uh, 131 00:08:37.880 --> 00:08:41.010 a sort of doom where she can't go back to valor. 132 00:08:41.010 --> 00:08:44.690 So the element in the story where 133 00:08:45.960 --> 00:08:49.050 this is in, I think it's yeah, it's in the first episode. 134 00:08:49.050 --> 00:08:52.410 So hopefully everyone's seen that where they're said, oh, it's okay. You, 135 00:08:52.410 --> 00:08:54.970 you luck can go back to valor, actually goad. 136 00:08:55.040 --> 00:08:58.440 That would be really problematic for her. Cause she's still under this doom. 137 00:08:58.820 --> 00:09:03.720 And that is, that is another moment for that to be lifted. Um, 138 00:09:04.350 --> 00:09:06.690 and also they've missed out poor old Keller. 139 00:09:07.280 --> 00:09:11.210 Born's been cut cuz she actually meets him in the first stage 140 00:09:11.950 --> 00:09:16.130 and they they're in love and live very happily for centuries, 141 00:09:16.130 --> 00:09:19.890 not always together, but they're, they're an item, um, 142 00:09:19.890 --> 00:09:23.100 for centuries way before the series starts. 143 00:09:23.200 --> 00:09:27.180 But of course the story reason for getting rid of him is it's more exciting to 144 00:09:27.180 --> 00:09:31.620 see her as a free agent. Whereas if she's got like ke born kind of alongside it, 145 00:09:31.640 --> 00:09:35.660 you can see how that doesn't work. So is being cut. 146 00:09:37.250 --> 00:09:40.190 Um, so there, the big difference is there, 147 00:09:41.230 --> 00:09:43.120 when you look at the other stories, 148 00:09:43.120 --> 00:09:47.830 they're following the overall impression that yes, 149 00:09:47.830 --> 00:09:52.110 collateral is aware of the return of evil and warns against Sarah, 150 00:09:52.110 --> 00:09:55.830 that is correct. That's where they're sticking to the script. 151 00:09:57.200 --> 00:09:57.930 Um, 152 00:09:57.930 --> 00:10:02.910 the idea that the men feel they're sort of under the Elvin boots, 153 00:10:05.420 --> 00:10:08.780 kinda, maybe an interesting, 154 00:10:09.280 --> 00:10:12.660 but actually it's the IANS. If you wanna be technical, 155 00:10:12.660 --> 00:10:17.340 who kind of are a bit more like the colonizing force at this time and we haven't 156 00:10:17.340 --> 00:10:18.420 even reached the new Menor, 157 00:10:19.240 --> 00:10:22.580 but I suppose you could say some men would've felt that 158 00:10:23.910 --> 00:10:28.330 half it, the proto ops. Yes, 159 00:10:28.330 --> 00:10:30.490 of course the hops must have had some ancestors around, 160 00:10:30.750 --> 00:10:32.490 but very little is known about them, 161 00:10:32.490 --> 00:10:36.130 which I suppose is quite good for a storytelling point of view because they can 162 00:10:36.130 --> 00:10:40.290 just kind of do anything with them as long as they're not really super visible. 163 00:10:41.210 --> 00:10:41.560 Um, 164 00:10:41.560 --> 00:10:46.040 it seems right that they would be a nomadic culture and you can see the choice 165 00:10:46.090 --> 00:10:49.360 of having a conservatism, 166 00:10:49.480 --> 00:10:53.640 which you see in the hobbits when they're settled, even within the half foot, 167 00:10:53.640 --> 00:10:56.440 you've got the idea, you don't leave the trail. So there's, 168 00:10:56.440 --> 00:11:00.360 there's they stick together as a group. So yeah, that all seems to, to fit, 169 00:11:01.290 --> 00:11:02.123 um, 170 00:11:03.390 --> 00:11:07.440 invented is AIA and Bronwin that storyline, 171 00:11:07.940 --> 00:11:10.840 but I dunno if you've noticed they live in the place, 172 00:11:10.880 --> 00:11:13.800 which later becomes on the map, 173 00:11:14.770 --> 00:11:15.930 anybody's spot where 174 00:11:17.880 --> 00:11:22.410 they're living basically in what becomes mortal, um, 175 00:11:23.960 --> 00:11:28.870 or in that very, that region or the brown lenss. So the big, 176 00:11:28.870 --> 00:11:32.550 the origins of evil that you see there with the sort of, you know, 177 00:11:32.550 --> 00:11:34.230 the cow with the black milk and everything, 178 00:11:34.230 --> 00:11:37.910 you can see the turning of those lands. So, you know, the, 179 00:11:37.910 --> 00:11:40.910 the omens are not great for their society. 180 00:11:42.360 --> 00:11:47.220 So that's a little sense of where it's following a track. 181 00:11:47.220 --> 00:11:51.980 I think the broad brush show brushstrokes are sort of on within 182 00:11:51.980 --> 00:11:54.640 the talking well, but there is a lot of particularly go gradual, 183 00:11:54.670 --> 00:11:59.080 like reimagining her to do a different job, um, 184 00:11:59.400 --> 00:12:04.370 which probably is sending some people, you know, crazy, but that, 185 00:12:04.370 --> 00:12:05.650 that's basically what they're doing. 186 00:12:06.500 --> 00:12:10.610 So I'm not gonna give a view on whether it's good or bad to do that. 187 00:12:11.190 --> 00:12:15.370 I'd like to hear how you felt, and this is where it goes over to you to discuss. 188 00:12:16.040 --> 00:12:18.210 What was your feeling about, um, 189 00:12:18.210 --> 00:12:22.490 the story that did you find it fun or did you find it too slow? 190 00:12:22.910 --> 00:12:26.810 Who would like to chip in with an, an early reaction 191 00:12:30.230 --> 00:12:31.590 Nancy off you go? 192 00:12:33.660 --> 00:12:37.100
So I do like it,193 00:12:38.190 --> 00:12:42.760 I watched both episodes twice. I, um, 194 00:12:44.240 --> 00:12:45.970 I feel like we're in middle earth, 195 00:12:46.530 --> 00:12:50.890 which was a really important thing. Um, 196 00:12:51.880 --> 00:12:52.713 I, 197 00:12:54.640 --> 00:12:59.490 I really liked the relationship between Elron and Durham and that 198 00:12:59.490 --> 00:13:03.370 we're gonna get to see Kaza doom at its height. 199 00:13:03.600 --> 00:13:05.090 I like that development. 200 00:13:05.920 --> 00:13:10.210 I really had a problem with Gori, 201 00:13:10.210 --> 00:13:14.010 only others being offered to go to valor. 202 00:13:15.180 --> 00:13:19.570 Um, not only because the way they made it look. 203 00:13:21.100 --> 00:13:22.850 So I find those, 204 00:13:23.620 --> 00:13:28.460 those female elves with the veils on really creepy <laugh> 205 00:13:28.720 --> 00:13:32.500 and I'm like, I don't understand what that is about. 206 00:13:32.600 --> 00:13:36.740 And so I was thinking about this last night after watching it for the sec, 207 00:13:36.740 --> 00:13:40.180 the second episode for the second time that, um, 208 00:13:41.120 --> 00:13:44.930 really gradual is the only female elf. 209 00:13:45.100 --> 00:13:48.450 We get to see her face basically. 210 00:13:49.110 --> 00:13:53.970 And I know she's the star, but it's very weird to me. And I was like, 211 00:13:54.520 --> 00:13:58.290 I mean, part of the reason why, you know, 212 00:13:58.290 --> 00:14:03.290 when we see GE at the mirror with photo and she gets 213 00:14:03.290 --> 00:14:07.450 all big and bad and then she comes back to herself and she's like, 214 00:14:07.450 --> 00:14:10.970 I passed the test, I can go into the west. I mean, 215 00:14:11.950 --> 00:14:13.480 part the thing, 216 00:14:13.480 --> 00:14:18.040 the reason that's so impactful is because she had been 217 00:14:18.110 --> 00:14:21.120 banned from valor and had, 218 00:14:22.380 --> 00:14:27.050 had to protect her little slice of 219 00:14:27.370 --> 00:14:31.930 Vindo and was fighting SAR that entire time 220 00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:36.810 with the help of the, with NA ne NAIA, 221 00:14:37.500 --> 00:14:42.170 um, and her NAIA. And, um, 222 00:14:43.080 --> 00:14:48.060 and so she does pass the test and become forgiven, you know? 223 00:14:48.190 --> 00:14:52.440 So by allowing her the opportunity to go back to Lanor, 224 00:14:52.440 --> 00:14:56.760 like right at the very beginning, I think it takes away from that. 225 00:14:57.930 --> 00:15:01.360 Um, I don't have a problem with her being this warrior. 226 00:15:02.770 --> 00:15:05.600 Um, Tolkin did say she was, you know, 227 00:15:05.600 --> 00:15:10.480 really strong and he called her name was like manmade in. And, um, 228 00:15:10.890 --> 00:15:14.000 so I don't really have a problem with that. I'm not, 229 00:15:14.000 --> 00:15:19.000 I was thinking about the whole caliber thing too last night that he 230 00:15:19.000 --> 00:15:23.280 could still be there. He could be, you know, 231 00:15:23.280 --> 00:15:27.360 because he's, they're not always together. Like you said, you know, 232 00:15:27.360 --> 00:15:31.640 and he could be off on his own doing the whole, you know, 233 00:15:31.640 --> 00:15:34.760 founding Lauren thing or whatever. 234 00:15:35.570 --> 00:15:37.880 So I just, um, 235 00:15:37.880 --> 00:15:42.160 cause I don't have a problem with them making her like this, but, 236 00:15:42.570 --> 00:15:45.680 um, I did kind of have a problem with, um, 237 00:15:45.790 --> 00:15:50.720 yoga led and him saying that 238 00:15:50.720 --> 00:15:53.800 evil was gone, you know, like he seemed an Elron, 239 00:15:53.800 --> 00:15:58.040 they both seemed like politicians sort of, you know, and I guess they would be. 240 00:15:58.040 --> 00:16:01.600 And I guess even in the Lord of the rings Elron was a bit of a politician, 241 00:16:01.790 --> 00:16:06.480 I mean, and, but to dismiss it so offhand, 242 00:16:06.740 --> 00:16:09.950 you know, just because, you know, 243 00:16:09.950 --> 00:16:11.790 she said she found includes, 244 00:16:11.790 --> 00:16:15.870 but I don't know that whole thing just seemed weird to me. Um, 245 00:16:15.870 --> 00:16:20.750 I love the hos the horror foots. Um, I love the horror foots. 246 00:16:21.020 --> 00:16:25.910 I love this mystery man who it does seem it 247 00:16:25.910 --> 00:16:29.750 is who I think it is. And I projected a while back that who it would be. 248 00:16:29.750 --> 00:16:32.870 But I'm wondering if they're going, I don't know if I wanna spoil that, 249 00:16:33.450 --> 00:16:38.270 but I I'm wondering if, if they're leading us on with that. 250 00:16:38.720 --> 00:16:42.870 Um, but I like the way the hard foots are being portrayed and they seem very 251 00:16:42.870 --> 00:16:44.310 natural. I mean, 252 00:16:44.310 --> 00:16:48.710 the elves are the ones that felt most stilted to me where the humans and the, 253 00:16:50.110 --> 00:16:54.610 the, um, hard foots seemed very, uh, 254 00:16:55.240 --> 00:16:59.300 real, um, uh, 255 00:17:01.720 --> 00:17:03.420 I'm not sure about the, 256 00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:08.500 the L human relationship right off the bat. And I'm also worried that, 257 00:17:08.500 --> 00:17:12.660 you know, this thing between gradual and, um, 258 00:17:13.400 --> 00:17:16.580 how brand, uh, they're hinting at something. 259 00:17:16.580 --> 00:17:20.540 And I don't think they should go there, but, um, 260 00:17:21.400 --> 00:17:26.000 you know, so far I really I'm happy with the way it looks. 261 00:17:26.270 --> 00:17:31.070 I I'm happy with the most of the 262 00:17:31.070 --> 00:17:35.750 characters the way they are. And I mean, there's, I, 263 00:17:36.340 --> 00:17:40.930 I think I heard there's only eight episodes and that's a lot to 264 00:17:40.930 --> 00:17:42.930 develop in the first season. And what, 265 00:17:42.930 --> 00:17:47.090 what had worried me was in seeing the previews, 266 00:17:47.410 --> 00:17:51.800 there was a whole lot going on very early, 267 00:17:52.140 --> 00:17:56.480 you know, like they really jumped the timeline. 268 00:17:56.480 --> 00:17:59.120 Like I know they said they com am I frozen? 269 00:18:00.130 --> 00:18:00.963
No.270 00:18:01.290 --> 00:18:05.440
It said they compressed it, but I think they may be compressing it too much.271 00:18:06.920 --> 00:18:11.070
So, um, I don't know about the,272 00:18:11.070 --> 00:18:16.070 the naked man, but I had, I, my I've got a kind of either or, 273 00:18:16.080 --> 00:18:18.270 oh, so I was thinking, well, 274 00:18:18.270 --> 00:18:23.230 it'd be fun to use that guy as the Hoit is introducing Sarah, 275 00:18:23.330 --> 00:18:23.830 you know, 276 00:18:23.830 --> 00:18:28.230 it could be Sarah who's kind of fallen angel fallen from the sky Lucifer figure. 277 00:18:28.850 --> 00:18:32.430 But because he's, and also it looks like an eye, you know, 278 00:18:32.430 --> 00:18:35.830 that's sort of in the middle of that thing. But then when I actually saw him, 279 00:18:35.830 --> 00:18:40.310 I thought, oh, he's definitely channeling a kind of GNED off the gray grunge. 280 00:18:40.800 --> 00:18:45.380 So maybe he's a wizard and he starts being a bit scary. 281 00:18:45.840 --> 00:18:49.100 And actually that's a classic thing to do. Isn't it. If it's, 282 00:18:49.220 --> 00:18:53.100 if it actually turns out to be good, you start him a bit scary. Whereas if, 283 00:18:53.100 --> 00:18:56.780 if he was gonna be Sarah, you'd start him being really nice. 284 00:18:57.490 --> 00:18:58.420
I, I do think.285 00:18:58.420 --> 00:19:02.900
He's and do it the other way. So my money's shifted being, if I'm in Vegas,286 00:19:03.000 --> 00:19:07.960 I'm gonna put him on the wizard Gand chip. I think, 287 00:19:08.030 --> 00:19:11.760 I dunno. What do other people think? Cause we don't know. I don't know. Uh. 288 00:19:11.910 --> 00:19:13.080
Yeah, especially.289 00:19:16.150 --> 00:19:18.780
So catch here. You've got your hand up. What, what's your view?290 00:19:19.730 --> 00:19:23.780
Yeah, so I enjoyed it more than I thought I would. I was very apprehensive.291 00:19:23.780 --> 00:19:27.780 They, they wouldn't be respectful to talk and, but they were, in my opinion, 292 00:19:27.930 --> 00:19:29.580 more respectful than not. 293 00:19:29.890 --> 00:19:34.420 I am totally in love with the couple of the woman healer and the guard 294 00:19:34.480 --> 00:19:36.180 elf. Um, 295 00:19:36.360 --> 00:19:41.300 and it did surprise me because I think the been totally imagined for the Amazon 296 00:19:41.300 --> 00:19:45.140 show, but I like the chemistry that they had. 297 00:19:45.450 --> 00:19:48.900 I liked the individual characters. Um, 298 00:19:48.900 --> 00:19:50.780 I think out of all of the ELFS, 299 00:19:50.780 --> 00:19:55.780 the guard for me had the most behavior that I would expect because I 300 00:19:55.780 --> 00:20:00.740 was very disappointed by almost all other elves. Um, a I, 301 00:20:00.740 --> 00:20:04.060 yeah. Uh, I was not convinced by the actor. Um, 302 00:20:04.110 --> 00:20:07.300 he didn't seem enough ELV to me <laugh> uh, 303 00:20:07.600 --> 00:20:11.580 but I did like the worst, uh, the hard foods. 304 00:20:12.320 --> 00:20:13.460 And then, yeah, 305 00:20:13.460 --> 00:20:17.980 generally I found it's very visually appealing kind of divided from collateral. 306 00:20:18.170 --> 00:20:22.380 Didn't like her in the first episode liked her very much on, 307 00:20:22.380 --> 00:20:25.980 in the second way more in the second episode. Um, 308 00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:28.980 but I also try, uh, it it's, yeah, 309 00:20:29.050 --> 00:20:32.540 it's kind of difficult for me to judge it, uh, 310 00:20:32.810 --> 00:20:35.460 with a lot of precision, uh, 311 00:20:35.460 --> 00:20:40.060 because I'm not that familiar with all of the prehistory of the middle earth. 312 00:20:41.310 --> 00:20:44.140 Uh, so yeah, uh, 313 00:20:44.140 --> 00:20:49.040 more happy way more happy than I thought I would be and love the 314 00:20:49.320 --> 00:20:53.040 elephant, uh, human couple generally. I'm always a sucker for a, 315 00:20:53.350 --> 00:20:58.040 a difficult love story. Um, so I'm for now, 316 00:20:58.040 --> 00:21:02.640 I'm mostly here to, to follow this couple. It's like my main interest for now. 317 00:21:03.810 --> 00:21:04.160
No,318 00:21:04.160 --> 00:21:07.240 that's really fascinating cuz they're the couple when they come on the screen, 319 00:21:07.240 --> 00:21:11.200 I think, oh, come on. <laugh> I'm less interested in them though. 320 00:21:11.200 --> 00:21:15.840 I do like his breast plate. I spend a lot of time looking at thinking, oh, 321 00:21:15.840 --> 00:21:17.840 it's a green man. Um. 322 00:21:18.530 --> 00:21:23.160
Oh yeah, yeah. Yeah. Because I, I think finally the costumes were very nice,323 00:21:23.180 --> 00:21:26.560 but it was a bit disappointed by the armor of the elves. 324 00:21:26.750 --> 00:21:30.640 I would expect more of intricate metal work, uh, 325 00:21:30.640 --> 00:21:34.040 on their armor and it's very plain to me, but yeah, 326 00:21:34.040 --> 00:21:35.160 it's the kind of need picking. 327 00:21:36.990 --> 00:21:40.880
Yeah. We, we, I spent a knit pick there. That's what we are here to do. I mean,328 00:21:41.220 --> 00:21:43.560 why not? Rowan, 329 00:21:43.560 --> 00:21:48.280 you got also had a hand raised. What was your reaction? 330 00:21:49.250 --> 00:21:50.083
Um,331 00:21:50.530 --> 00:21:55.120 so potentially controversial in a room full of such dedicated, uh, 332 00:21:55.120 --> 00:21:58.960 talking fans and fans of literature and the books, 333 00:22:00.050 --> 00:22:02.880 um, as am I obviously, 334 00:22:02.880 --> 00:22:05.200 but when I was younger, 335 00:22:05.670 --> 00:22:08.360 I was super critical of any, um, 336 00:22:08.830 --> 00:22:13.800 film or TV show that did not replicate exactly the book I had 337 00:22:13.800 --> 00:22:17.720 just read it, ruined it for me. If I did not see an exact, 338 00:22:17.750 --> 00:22:22.030 like the same version of that story on that screen, 339 00:22:23.100 --> 00:22:24.010 as I've got older, 340 00:22:24.010 --> 00:22:28.930 I could not be less interested in seeing an exact copy of the book on 341 00:22:28.930 --> 00:22:30.880 screen. Um, 342 00:22:33.680 --> 00:22:34.513 and 343 00:22:35.690 --> 00:22:40.660 like I think it that's come with having a different understanding of art now 344 00:22:40.660 --> 00:22:45.500 and also like studying film and studying TV a bit more and like learning the 345 00:22:45.500 --> 00:22:49.420 differences between like writing for, you know, writing a novel writing, 346 00:22:49.420 --> 00:22:51.580 short stories, writing for TV writing film, 347 00:22:52.240 --> 00:22:56.740 I'm a bit more sympathetic to TV and film writers now in knowing that 348 00:22:57.520 --> 00:23:00.520 every scene has to have something, you know, there has to, but yeah, 349 00:23:00.580 --> 00:23:04.640 and talking was not a writer who condensed things. 350 00:23:07.490 --> 00:23:10.680 He was not, not a writer who condensed things. Um, 351 00:23:12.010 --> 00:23:16.430 and you have to do that in TV. Um, and you have to, 352 00:23:16.430 --> 00:23:20.830 every single scene has to have, that has to have something, 353 00:23:21.330 --> 00:23:24.950 you know, with film has to have something in it. So while there was some things, 354 00:23:25.520 --> 00:23:27.630 um, that I was like, oh, you know, the, 355 00:23:27.630 --> 00:23:31.670 the talking nerd in me went a little bit oh, you know, like, um, you know, 356 00:23:31.670 --> 00:23:36.430 going to, uh, VA or, and, you know, think, you know, going back there, 357 00:23:36.460 --> 00:23:40.630 I was a bit like, oh, that's a bit odd. Um, 358 00:23:41.210 --> 00:23:44.270 and then I thought, yeah, you know what, though, I can see why they've done it. 359 00:23:46.130 --> 00:23:50.200 Um, I sort of look at it with very different, 360 00:23:52.060 --> 00:23:56.120 you know, different hats now, I guess I wear when I'm watching something on TV. 361 00:23:57.090 --> 00:24:00.880 Um, so I really loved it. Um, 362 00:24:02.220 --> 00:24:06.070 I like what Nancy said about feeling like you're in middle earth, cuz I, 363 00:24:06.070 --> 00:24:09.830 I got that feeling too. That was one of the most important thing for me, 364 00:24:09.830 --> 00:24:13.670 I think, um, not it being a, 365 00:24:15.120 --> 00:24:20.070 uh, exact copy of the characters that were written, um, 366 00:24:21.290 --> 00:24:26.160 in the books and not it being the 367 00:24:26.160 --> 00:24:29.040 exact sort of, you know, law that was in the books, 368 00:24:29.040 --> 00:24:33.640 but more that feeling of middle earth, that feeling of going home, um, 369 00:24:34.060 --> 00:24:38.240 was the most important thing for me. And I definitely got that. Um, 370 00:24:40.560 --> 00:24:45.390 so yeah, that's, that's how I feel about it. I think with seeing, um, 371 00:24:46.960 --> 00:24:51.730 characters as well that we've got to know through reading the books and also 372 00:24:51.970 --> 00:24:53.330 watching like the older, the rings in the Hobbit, 373 00:24:53.400 --> 00:24:56.890 seeing new actors take on those roles is always gonna be a bit, 374 00:24:56.890 --> 00:25:00.730 even at a different time is always gonna be a bit jarring at first. You know, 375 00:25:00.730 --> 00:25:02.890 you've sort of have to, um, 376 00:25:03.150 --> 00:25:07.010 refamiliarize yourself with that character again, 377 00:25:07.010 --> 00:25:09.370 because you are seeing them on screen, but it's, you know, 378 00:25:09.370 --> 00:25:10.330 it's a different actor. 379 00:25:10.330 --> 00:25:13.490 They're bringing something completely different to the character. And I, 380 00:25:13.560 --> 00:25:17.250 I understand like people's sort of, um, 381 00:25:17.890 --> 00:25:19.930 reactions like Elron especially like, 382 00:25:19.930 --> 00:25:23.970 but I think we will become familiar with them again, we will, 383 00:25:24.870 --> 00:25:28.570 you know, you know, become acquainted with them and that, uh, 384 00:25:29.820 --> 00:25:34.670 um, this, um, portrayal of, 385 00:25:34.760 --> 00:25:37.270 of him and the other characters as well. But it, 386 00:25:37.270 --> 00:25:42.030 it does definitely have that sort of jarring feeling at first. Um, but yeah, 387 00:25:42.030 --> 00:25:45.670 I think that'll, I think that'll come in time. Um, I think. 388 00:25:46.000 --> 00:25:49.390
To pick up on your point about Elron there is, I did see him as a politician.389 00:25:49.390 --> 00:25:52.430 I saw him as a diplomat as an ex diplomat, 390 00:25:52.580 --> 00:25:56.870 what he was doing particularly in the second episode is 391 00:25:57.740 --> 00:26:02.550 he's clearly doing the ambassador role. And I like that. Cause I thought, oh, 392 00:26:02.550 --> 00:26:07.190 this is a really interesting way of explaining his role in middle earth, 393 00:26:08.080 --> 00:26:13.070 um, because of his half. And no, I thought that was, I really enjoyed that. 394 00:26:13.190 --> 00:26:17.030 We've had a correction from Nancy who is our absolute expert. Um, 395 00:26:17.080 --> 00:26:20.550 so you know, far more expert than I am. Um, 396 00:26:21.380 --> 00:26:26.310 Ronwin and Aron Deere are in tier hared. I was getting a bit kind of map. 397 00:26:27.150 --> 00:26:30.090 Can you get map queasy? Cause it gets swooping over the map. 398 00:26:30.090 --> 00:26:31.410 I couldn't quite follow where they were going, 399 00:26:31.410 --> 00:26:35.090 which she says she thinks is near her ad, which is obviously Southern. 400 00:26:36.220 --> 00:26:40.680 Um, so maybe their, their land is okay though. 401 00:26:40.730 --> 00:26:42.800 It infested with olive fonts maybe. 402 00:26:43.820 --> 00:26:47.290
Oh yeah, my money's on Gander. Sorry Alexandra. I, yeah,403 00:26:47.290 --> 00:26:50.890 my that's where I'm putting my, my money. It was the, but again, 404 00:26:50.890 --> 00:26:54.330 it could be red herring. Like it's one of those things, but it, for me, 405 00:26:54.330 --> 00:26:54.810 I was like, 406 00:26:54.810 --> 00:26:58.730 this feels a lot like feels a lot like Gander and then it was the whispering to 407 00:26:58.730 --> 00:27:01.570 the fireflies. I was like, okay, that's very clear callback. 408 00:27:01.570 --> 00:27:05.370 I think this is scan. Um, so yeah, that's, that's, 409 00:27:05.370 --> 00:27:06.490 that's what I'm putting my money on. 410 00:27:07.580 --> 00:27:11.000
Or a blue wizard about whom we know not very much,411 00:27:11.060 --> 00:27:14.120 you always go for the ones about whom, you know, nothing, but. 412 00:27:14.120 --> 00:27:16.880
He says, he says something like man,413 00:27:18.670 --> 00:27:23.400 when he speaks and I think Ure is the name of, um, 414 00:27:23.700 --> 00:27:26.480 the creator <inaudible> or something like that. 415 00:27:27.340 --> 00:27:30.990
You're very good. If you can, if you can actually interpret what he's saying, I,416 00:27:31.020 --> 00:27:35.430 I, I should put the captions on for that bit. Uh, Alex, 417 00:27:35.920 --> 00:27:39.710 um, you've also had with us. 418 00:27:40.910 --> 00:27:44.510
Actually love the, the TV show obviously.419 00:27:44.650 --> 00:27:48.950 And I wanted to come back on the Brun Brun win. Oranger sorry. 420 00:27:49.460 --> 00:27:52.590 That was something I found very clever because for me, 421 00:27:52.590 --> 00:27:56.230 it's showing the evil and so without showing it, 422 00:27:56.800 --> 00:27:58.180 and I think it was a, 423 00:27:58.250 --> 00:28:02.420 a good way of like kind of subtle ish because, well, 424 00:28:02.420 --> 00:28:03.980 I guess we all picked that up, 425 00:28:03.980 --> 00:28:08.140 but it's a good way of showing him without having to go too much into 426 00:28:09.100 --> 00:28:12.790 portraying the actual evil right now, because everybody's looking for him, 427 00:28:12.790 --> 00:28:15.910 but you still have to have him somewhere, even if, 428 00:28:15.910 --> 00:28:20.910 but you can't show it because otherwise the whole gradual quest, uh, is useless. 429 00:28:20.910 --> 00:28:22.510 I guess, if you know exactly where he is. 430 00:28:22.920 --> 00:28:26.550 So I kind of like that and on the acting, 431 00:28:27.260 --> 00:28:31.030 I feel like, I don't know if it's just me, but it's been a while. 432 00:28:31.030 --> 00:28:35.990 I haven't seen actors bring me directly and so vividly 433 00:28:35.990 --> 00:28:39.310 into the whole world. I for, I didn't, 434 00:28:40.060 --> 00:28:43.910 I had to come back for a second when I still get agile space, 435 00:28:43.980 --> 00:28:48.190 I knew it was her immediately. I didn't had a second of like, 436 00:28:48.370 --> 00:28:50.230 who could she be? It was like obvious. 437 00:28:50.810 --> 00:28:53.830 And I think I had that feeling for most of the characters. 438 00:28:54.200 --> 00:28:57.030 So I think they did very well in casting, 439 00:28:57.160 --> 00:29:02.070 in finding actors that kind of look like the older version of 440 00:29:02.070 --> 00:29:05.230 themselves and still are good with the bigger, 441 00:29:05.230 --> 00:29:07.910 I just pick someone that looks like and will do the job. 442 00:29:07.910 --> 00:29:11.750 Somehow people will find it, I guess, but I don't know. They, 443 00:29:11.750 --> 00:29:15.630 they look like them and they also play well. So I think it's kinda, well. 444 00:29:16.900 --> 00:29:21.590
I thought that Nori actually has almost like Elijah wood eyes,445 00:29:23.250 --> 00:29:25.910 you know, you were saying, so you got you think, yeah, 446 00:29:25.910 --> 00:29:28.390 that's that kind of works. And I was looking at Norie, 447 00:29:28.390 --> 00:29:32.710 she's got these one me as I talk about the eyes of the young gala later. 448 00:29:33.500 --> 00:29:35.870 Like when that first started, I thought, my goodness, this, 449 00:29:35.870 --> 00:29:39.270 this girl is just astonishing, you know. 450 00:29:39.850 --> 00:29:40.270
And.451 00:29:40.270 --> 00:29:44.200
They've done some very good casting picks, I think. Uh, and.452 00:29:44.350 --> 00:29:46.440
I was wondering about, about, no,453 00:29:46.440 --> 00:29:50.640 that he's a Brandy wondering if there's any relation to the Brandy 454 00:29:51.520 --> 00:29:52.353 actually. 455 00:29:52.640 --> 00:29:53.473
Oh yeah.456 00:29:59.360 --> 00:30:02.110 They've taken a bit of one name and put it with a bit of another. 457 00:30:02.160 --> 00:30:06.390
Exactly. And my money is on Zo as well, but the.458 00:30:06.390 --> 00:30:08.470
Well, it'd be very funny when, when we come,459 00:30:08.480 --> 00:30:12.750 we should meet back at the end of the series and have another chat about it once 460 00:30:12.750 --> 00:30:16.630 we've given the whole story arc. Um, and once we've lost all our money, 461 00:30:16.630 --> 00:30:19.870 like we've all been proven wrong or something. Yeah, that's right. 462 00:30:22.020 --> 00:30:23.790
From the beginning. <laugh>.463 00:30:24.060 --> 00:30:28.030
Yeah. I mean, when I'm watching, throwing out random things like, oh,464 00:30:28.030 --> 00:30:30.870 maybe that little boy turns out to be the mouse of Sarah. You know, 465 00:30:30.870 --> 00:30:33.510 the one who's got, um, from wins, picks up the other, 466 00:30:33.710 --> 00:30:36.110 cause he's got quite print, you know, 467 00:30:36.340 --> 00:30:40.350 he's got a bad wicked thing and he is a he's he's a man. 468 00:30:40.350 --> 00:30:44.920 So he is gonna be he's doomed. Um, anyway, 469 00:30:46.000 --> 00:30:48.720 probably none of these things will come to pass, but anyway, 470 00:30:48.720 --> 00:30:51.320 it's quite fun to guess. So, um, 471 00:30:51.320 --> 00:30:55.720 some of you've mentioned already some performances, so we've sort of, 472 00:30:55.870 --> 00:30:59.880 most people are quite happy with story choices, cuz absolutely like Rowan, 473 00:30:59.900 --> 00:31:04.230 you do different things when you're making a TV show. Absolutely. 474 00:31:04.690 --> 00:31:09.350 And you put in a few really handsome else, like a on Deere and we are all happy, 475 00:31:09.370 --> 00:31:11.070 you know, why not? Um, 476 00:31:11.850 --> 00:31:16.630 but what about the actual acting performances I I've seen there was, um, 477 00:31:16.630 --> 00:31:20.340 one of the newspapers here gave it like a one star. I thought, 478 00:31:20.340 --> 00:31:24.420 how can you give it a one star? It was like a daily mail or something. My, uh, 479 00:31:24.420 --> 00:31:29.260 family pointed out to me. Definitely. I thought the acting was great. 480 00:31:29.520 --> 00:31:33.860 And I particularly liked, I mean there all, there's nobody default at all. 481 00:31:34.330 --> 00:31:39.210 I particularly liked gala's acting when she said 482 00:31:39.210 --> 00:31:40.043 nothing. 483 00:31:40.960 --> 00:31:44.990 So like in the scenes when Gil Gallad is saying off you go 484 00:31:45.870 --> 00:31:50.830 evils over off you go, you could see within an Elvin restraint, 485 00:31:50.830 --> 00:31:55.450 her utter dis kind of the force of the emotion. 486 00:31:55.450 --> 00:31:59.930 I thought she did a fantastic job. So she gets a shout out for me. 487 00:31:59.930 --> 00:32:02.690 Anybody else wants to give a shout out for some of the performances, 488 00:32:05.840 --> 00:32:06.673 Christina? 489 00:32:08.030 --> 00:32:13.000
Well, I was keeping quiet because I've only almost finished the first episode,490 00:32:13.000 --> 00:32:17.320 but I thought of all the things I'm still warming up to the serious in general, 491 00:32:17.320 --> 00:32:19.080 like the story and the feel of it. 492 00:32:19.080 --> 00:32:23.880 Because for me the feel I'm still I'm getting used to it because it has a lot of 493 00:32:23.880 --> 00:32:27.960 the modern, serious feel rather than the Lord of the rings movie feel, 494 00:32:27.960 --> 00:32:31.320 which is clearly, it's just a different medium. 495 00:32:31.530 --> 00:32:35.920 So it's going to feel different. But I thought that in terms of acting, 496 00:32:35.920 --> 00:32:38.870 it actually was really, really nice. I really liked it. 497 00:32:39.560 --> 00:32:44.400 Maybe I'm just going to guess maybe the reason they gave the one 498 00:32:44.400 --> 00:32:47.120 star is because they didn't get the same feel. 499 00:32:47.900 --> 00:32:52.640 But I think it's more about the fact that it's a 500 00:32:52.640 --> 00:32:54.320 different interpretation. First of all, 501 00:32:54.320 --> 00:32:56.560 you get different actors and different interpretations, 502 00:32:56.560 --> 00:33:00.080 which is always going to feel different. And if you're used to people, 503 00:33:00.590 --> 00:33:04.040 like if you used to L run from the load of the rings films, 504 00:33:04.350 --> 00:33:08.240 you're gonna have to re get reused to the new L Rund. 505 00:33:09.270 --> 00:33:10.103
Yeah.506 00:33:10.230 --> 00:33:13.520
I completely disagree with the one star review. I would be acting.507 00:33:14.410 --> 00:33:17.340
I wouldn't be surprised if it's a political choice knowing the newspaper,508 00:33:17.680 --> 00:33:22.580 you know, they they're having a let's let's get it Amazon, um, possibly, 509 00:33:22.870 --> 00:33:25.060 or they sent along their critic who hates fantasy. 510 00:33:25.160 --> 00:33:30.140 Cuz obviously that would be a disaster if they only like kind of Mike Lee films 511 00:33:30.140 --> 00:33:33.980 or something, you know? Um, yeah. Um, 512 00:33:34.770 --> 00:33:39.150 so what about their creative, um, realization of it? 513 00:33:40.300 --> 00:33:44.450 We know that I think wetter workshop were involved, but they didn't, 514 00:33:44.450 --> 00:33:49.330 they didn't sort of get Peter Jackson along to sort of advise, 515 00:33:49.330 --> 00:33:52.240 but it clearly is owing a lot 516 00:33:53.760 --> 00:33:58.570 architecturally and everything to the original look of the 517 00:33:58.570 --> 00:34:01.050 Lord of the rings trilogy. Um, 518 00:34:01.050 --> 00:34:05.460 but were you happy with the feel of the places and 519 00:34:06.210 --> 00:34:08.740 some of you already said you felt like you were in middle earth. 520 00:34:09.620 --> 00:34:14.260 Anything else you wanna say about costumes, music, uh, 521 00:34:15.130 --> 00:34:17.860 sets locations, Elizabeth, 522 00:34:18.010 --> 00:34:21.400 what did you think your muted. 523 00:34:24.020 --> 00:34:26.360
I'm getting a sign to be muted. Um,524 00:34:26.820 --> 00:34:30.360 now thank you for asking that question and I'm gonna give a very simple 525 00:34:30.500 --> 00:34:34.280 observation and it, it meets with what you're asking. 526 00:34:34.390 --> 00:34:35.640 That's what drew me. 527 00:34:36.230 --> 00:34:40.440 I was loving it and then I really loved it when I became aware of the music. 528 00:34:41.260 --> 00:34:44.720 And there was a moment where I was like, okay, 529 00:34:44.780 --> 00:34:49.480 I'm really totally into this because the music is very important to me. 530 00:34:50.500 --> 00:34:54.720 And um, uh, and I can't really cite exactly, you know, 531 00:34:54.720 --> 00:34:58.200 when and where that happened. But, um, that, 532 00:34:58.200 --> 00:35:02.680 that kind of linked me to the Peter Jackson films, not continually, 533 00:35:03.140 --> 00:35:05.000 but, um, yeah. 534 00:35:05.150 --> 00:35:08.480
That, so the, the theme music, which you only hear in full,535 00:35:08.490 --> 00:35:11.600 if you go into the second episode, um, by the way. 536 00:35:12.130 --> 00:35:13.000
So maybe it was.537 00:35:13.000 --> 00:35:17.080
Then the title sequence isn't run in the first one, um,538 00:35:17.090 --> 00:35:21.280 is by Howard shore who did the music for Lord of the rings films. 539 00:35:22.370 --> 00:35:26.760 Um, and then the other music is by somebody called, 540 00:35:26.760 --> 00:35:30.360 I think it's Ben NEK. I might not be saying his, 541 00:35:30.380 --> 00:35:33.600 his or her name correctly. Um, but there's, 542 00:35:33.600 --> 00:35:35.560 you can listen to the soundtrack on Spotify, 543 00:35:35.560 --> 00:35:38.320 which we did as we were driving home from our holiday. 544 00:35:38.420 --> 00:35:42.640 And there's some really good, um, music in there. 545 00:35:42.640 --> 00:35:45.520 I particularly liked. I didn't like the scene, 546 00:35:45.520 --> 00:35:49.840 but I like the music when they're going to valor, which looks like death. To me, 547 00:35:50.050 --> 00:35:54.400 it looks like it being, yeah, it looked like that's my problem with it. Um, 548 00:35:54.980 --> 00:35:57.880 but the song that they say they've all got inside them, 549 00:35:57.880 --> 00:35:59.000 they all started singing. 550 00:35:59.000 --> 00:36:02.400 I thought that was beautifully done cuz that tune was played earlier. 551 00:36:02.970 --> 00:36:07.000 So you already prepared. And so when they started singing it, 552 00:36:07.550 --> 00:36:11.400 that was a very magical moment. I thought I did it really nicely though. 553 00:36:11.400 --> 00:36:15.480 I did think glad could have done with a better plan <laugh> than just jumping 554 00:36:15.480 --> 00:36:20.200 off the boat and having to swim back. I did laugh actually. 555 00:36:20.200 --> 00:36:24.650 That was the moment where it broke the, the sort of, yeah, I thought, okay, 556 00:36:24.650 --> 00:36:29.130 that's a bit dat, but anyway, she's an elf. She she's she's good at swimming. 557 00:36:29.130 --> 00:36:30.010 She'll be fine. 558 00:36:31.400 --> 00:36:36.290
Yeah. I was, I will add one other comment again, more general than, uh,559 00:36:36.490 --> 00:36:40.890 directing at one specific thing. Um, yeah, I did. 560 00:36:40.890 --> 00:36:45.730 I did find it magical. I did, um, the, 561 00:36:45.730 --> 00:36:50.170 the movement of the scenes and you know, what you, 562 00:36:50.170 --> 00:36:54.490 how you were introduced to it, you know, for lack of a better expression. I did, 563 00:36:54.630 --> 00:36:59.090 did find it to like magical, you know, and hopefully you like that. 564 00:36:59.740 --> 00:37:00.573 So. 565 00:37:01.220 --> 00:37:02.130
Because I was.566 00:37:02.130 --> 00:37:06.370
Gonna be disappointed if it wasn't. Yeah. If I didn't feel moved that way,567 00:37:06.800 --> 00:37:08.610 I was gonna really be disappointed. 568 00:37:09.460 --> 00:37:10.490
So we just have a, a,569 00:37:10.520 --> 00:37:14.690 a final little moment on costumes before we sort of do a round up of, 570 00:37:14.690 --> 00:37:18.490 of a out of five stars kind of thing. Um, 571 00:37:19.610 --> 00:37:21.410 somebody's already mentioned, I sort, I'm sorry. 572 00:37:21.410 --> 00:37:25.720 I forget who it was said that they thought the armor was a bit plain. 573 00:37:26.170 --> 00:37:27.720 Um, not quite enough. 574 00:37:27.840 --> 00:37:31.240 You'd have thought they'd had some VIN scripts and you know, 575 00:37:31.240 --> 00:37:34.320 they spend a lot of that on their weapons maybe. Um, 576 00:37:34.980 --> 00:37:39.760 but does anyone have anything they'd like to mention about sort of 577 00:37:39.980 --> 00:37:44.360 the dressing of the characters? I mean, a really strong look is the, um, 578 00:37:44.860 --> 00:37:49.300 the hobbits who all having a terribly bad hair day 579 00:37:52.550 --> 00:37:54.580 or a good hair day. If, if that's, 580 00:37:54.580 --> 00:37:58.020 if you like kind of dreadlocks with acorns, 581 00:38:00.130 --> 00:38:03.650 it's quite fun. I thought, I, I, 582 00:38:03.990 --> 00:38:08.660 the one thing I would say about the Harit is I wish they wouldn't give the women 583 00:38:09.460 --> 00:38:14.100 loads of skirts and trousers kind of pick aside, pick a lane, 584 00:38:14.750 --> 00:38:15.100 um, 585 00:38:15.100 --> 00:38:19.860 because it seems really unnecessary to go around 586 00:38:19.860 --> 00:38:24.140 a great big skirt and then killed it up. That bugged me. 587 00:38:25.500 --> 00:38:28.500 <inaudible> you've got a few. Yeah, I have more. 588 00:38:29.260 --> 00:38:29.740
Question.589 00:38:29.740 --> 00:38:34.620
Actually, because I remember, but I'm, uh, that, uh, I don't remember the exact.590 00:38:34.620 --> 00:38:39.000
Phrase that Tokin was using. So the, normally the, uh, the,591 00:38:39.000 --> 00:38:43.920 the women's warfs are supposed to have beers or there was like a rumor 592 00:38:43.920 --> 00:38:47.600 that they were supposed to have beer. Um, the, the beers, 593 00:38:47.630 --> 00:38:51.160 what was the Tolkin position on that? Do you do, you know, 594 00:38:51.160 --> 00:38:53.400 because I expected them to have beers, 595 00:38:53.400 --> 00:38:55.560 but I knew from the previous that they wouldn't have. 596 00:38:55.560 --> 00:38:59.800 And I thought that would be interesting visual to, to have, uh, yeah, 597 00:38:59.860 --> 00:39:02.920 but maybe it's not even part of the official Canon. 598 00:39:03.500 --> 00:39:05.000
And Nancy might know the answer.599 00:39:05.000 --> 00:39:07.720 I I've got a feeling that is a vague mention of it. 600 00:39:08.060 --> 00:39:12.160 But did you notice that had a little bit of a sideburn going on? 601 00:39:12.490 --> 00:39:13.600
Oh, no, I haven't not.602 00:39:13.750 --> 00:39:17.960
Yeah. So there's a, there's a nod. She's got like a little beard, so there's.603 00:39:17.960 --> 00:39:19.720
Stick with it kinda.604 00:39:19.720 --> 00:39:24.200
Very subtle. She's it doesn't make a difference. You know,605 00:39:24.430 --> 00:39:27.080 beards is there, 606 00:39:27.410 --> 00:39:30.640 is there a canonical answer on beards or not beards? 607 00:39:34.350 --> 00:39:36.640 Have you got a view on that, Nancy? 608 00:39:36.790 --> 00:39:41.620
Yeah. Can, am I breaking up? Cause I a.609 00:39:41.620 --> 00:39:43.900
Little bit just carry, carry on though. You're fine again now.610 00:39:44.670 --> 00:39:45.820
Oh, okay. So611 00:39:47.780 --> 00:39:50.590 Tolkin did say that. Um, 612 00:39:50.590 --> 00:39:53.070 well he kind of said that there were female doors, 613 00:39:53.170 --> 00:39:55.270 but you didn't see them because he, 614 00:39:55.270 --> 00:39:58.790 they looked like the male doors and they did have beards. 615 00:39:59.010 --> 00:40:03.590 And so that was one of the things that a lot of the fans are were 616 00:40:03.870 --> 00:40:07.470 complaining about because DSA did have like a little bit here, 617 00:40:07.890 --> 00:40:11.590 but in that scene where they're chopping the rocks, 618 00:40:11.590 --> 00:40:15.230 none of the other female dorms had beards. 619 00:40:15.280 --> 00:40:19.870 So I think it is gonna be a sticking port point for true DOF 620 00:40:20.100 --> 00:40:21.990 fans. But I, 621 00:40:22.100 --> 00:40:26.750 I thought the din kingdom was better realized than the Elvin 622 00:40:26.750 --> 00:40:29.630 kingdom. I mean, I 623 00:40:32.260 --> 00:40:36.830 costumes really elaborate and layered and nuanced and 624 00:40:38.680 --> 00:40:42.880 loved and home with the, 625 00:40:43.010 --> 00:40:45.160 we saw the VIN cities from a distance. 626 00:40:45.160 --> 00:40:49.840 Maybe that's why I feel this way because we didn't really get to see, 627 00:40:49.870 --> 00:40:51.280 they were always outside. 628 00:40:51.730 --> 00:40:56.440 We didn't really get to see any structures really close up. 629 00:40:57.700 --> 00:41:02.680
I think VIN city is always looking incredibly drafty <laugh>, you know,630 00:41:02.680 --> 00:41:06.480 they don't feel like real places. Do they? Whereas the dwarf kingdom, 631 00:41:06.550 --> 00:41:08.120 I really enjoyed seeing the, 632 00:41:08.120 --> 00:41:12.490 the mirrors that were used to bring the light down so they could do agriculture. 633 00:41:12.560 --> 00:41:15.450 They just walk past it. I love that. And you're right. 634 00:41:15.450 --> 00:41:18.570 There was sort of detail there. We should round up our conversation, 635 00:41:18.570 --> 00:41:20.330 just take Elizabeth. Uh, 636 00:41:20.330 --> 00:41:23.850 and I'm gonna ask you for your kind of four out of five vote. 637 00:41:24.220 --> 00:41:29.210 If you could put it, um, in the chat, we can do an overall score from us, 638 00:41:30.180 --> 00:41:32.970 um, from the project Northmore creatives, 639 00:41:33.430 --> 00:41:36.560 Oxford center for fantasy creatives. So, Elizabeth, 640 00:41:36.560 --> 00:41:39.400 what was your little comment you were gonna have there. 641 00:41:39.970 --> 00:41:44.560
So way back when, um, when you were envisioning with all of us on project,642 00:41:44.560 --> 00:41:46.600 Northmore you put up a post and said, well, 643 00:41:47.010 --> 00:41:50.240 it was way back at the very beginning. What, what are you wondering about? 644 00:41:50.240 --> 00:41:54.000 And it's just like a, you know, pub curiosity question, the, 645 00:41:54.000 --> 00:41:58.200 the dwarf women and the beard, but mainly over and above that, 646 00:41:58.200 --> 00:42:01.360 I'm more interested in the fact that they weren't visible really. 647 00:42:01.360 --> 00:42:06.240 They didn't have a, a role. I think that's more fascinating than, you know, 648 00:42:06.240 --> 00:42:08.280 what they look like basically, um, 649 00:42:08.280 --> 00:42:12.680 which are very nice looking by the way in the, in the new production. Um, 650 00:42:13.260 --> 00:42:17.120 but I, so just, you know, like weird curiosity, like, okay, 651 00:42:17.120 --> 00:42:21.600 I'm gonna look up online and see if I can see any images of a dwarf woman with a 652 00:42:21.600 --> 00:42:25.880 beard. And, um, one creative person did it very nicely. 653 00:42:26.160 --> 00:42:28.800 Actually they had their hair kind of grown, you know, 654 00:42:28.800 --> 00:42:31.600 longer and braided in the front, 655 00:42:31.830 --> 00:42:36.560 like this sort of like a beard, you know, visually like it'd be in front, 656 00:42:36.560 --> 00:42:40.160 but it wasn't really a beard, but it, you know, so who knows what beard means, 657 00:42:40.160 --> 00:42:40.993 right. 658 00:42:42.350 --> 00:42:44.400
Indeed on that poser.659 00:42:45.370 --> 00:42:48.520 So just while you come up with your we're giving it, uh, 660 00:42:48.520 --> 00:42:53.440 a sort of score out of five stars. Okay. So if you like to, um, 661 00:42:53.440 --> 00:42:58.000 put in your score, we'll have an overall total, but, 662 00:42:58.130 --> 00:43:01.240 um, my husband came up with a summary. I rather liked, 663 00:43:01.240 --> 00:43:04.000 which I thought I'd share with you. So he said, right. 664 00:43:04.250 --> 00:43:08.760 So that means the dwarfs are Scottish. 665 00:43:10.100 --> 00:43:12.040 The hobbits are Irish, 666 00:43:13.270 --> 00:43:15.250 the elves are Welsh. 667 00:43:16.940 --> 00:43:21.400 The men are English and the money is American, 668 00:43:23.790 --> 00:43:25.270 which I thought was a great summary. 669 00:43:25.450 --> 00:43:29.910 Cuz if you actually follow the accents as somebody native to here, 670 00:43:30.510 --> 00:43:35.310 goads a bit Welsh. So it works. Okay. 671 00:43:36.440 --> 00:43:41.030 So let me go through, Oh, it's pretty good. 672 00:43:41.030 --> 00:43:44.240 We got 2, 3, 4. 673 00:43:45.580 --> 00:43:49.070 I would say we're giving it about 4.2 out of five. 674 00:43:50.360 --> 00:43:55.030 Um, so between four and five, which I think Amazon can be quite happy about. 675 00:43:55.700 --> 00:43:56.190 Okay. 676 00:43:56.190 --> 00:43:59.750 And not that they're gonna care cuz there's enough money there to take a hit. 677 00:43:59.970 --> 00:44:00.870 But um, 678 00:44:01.120 --> 00:44:05.790 we seem fairly happy with it and I for one is certainly going to follow it all 679 00:44:05.790 --> 00:44:10.590 the way through. And if some of it makes me laugh, well that's fine. 680 00:44:10.930 --> 00:44:15.870 But mostly I'm just enjoying seeing more images and more, 681 00:44:15.870 --> 00:44:20.030 very clever people, creatively reinterpreting TH's world. 682 00:44:20.640 --> 00:44:25.030 So good. I really hope they carry on and good luck to them. Um, 683 00:44:25.800 --> 00:44:27.750 so my final bet, 684 00:44:28.500 --> 00:44:32.520 the end of the second episode Gilad is about to be scooped up out of the sea. 685 00:44:33.560 --> 00:44:36.500 I'm hoping that that's gonna be a new Manian ship. 686 00:44:37.710 --> 00:44:42.600 I know she doesn't in the book go to new Menor if I'm aware, but maybe she does. 687 00:44:43.700 --> 00:44:46.570 Um, so that's my bit, anybody else got a bit who's on the ship, 688 00:44:50.140 --> 00:44:50.700 Nancy, 689 00:44:50.700 --> 00:44:55.650 have you got a view or she may know Nancy's often got 690 00:44:55.650 --> 00:44:58.810 the inside track anyway. So we'll find out. 691 00:44:59.080 --> 00:44:59.913
I think I.692 00:45:02.040 --> 00:45:02.600
Don't.693 00:45:02.600 --> 00:45:04.320
Have the inside track, but I think it's his silver.694 00:45:06.400 --> 00:45:10.830
Oh, so that would be new Andorian um, in that he was one of the,695 00:45:10.930 --> 00:45:15.150 the elf friends. Yeah. That's even more specific than, than my, 696 00:45:16.080 --> 00:45:19.590 my punt. Okay. Thank you everyone. I hope you enjoyed that. 697 00:45:19.760 --> 00:45:23.590 We reconvene to have a sort of final kick around, 698 00:45:24.340 --> 00:45:27.910 I suppose it's gonna be like November or something when it finishes. Um, 699 00:45:28.080 --> 00:45:31.310 so we can have a chat and the how it all went. 700 00:45:32.360 --> 00:45:36.430 So thank you very much for joining me this evening. Thank you. 701 00:45:36.590 --> 00:45:39.470 Thank you. Bye bye everybody so much. 702 00:45:42.340 --> 00:45:43.173 That was fun. 703 00:45:44.520 --> 00:45:46.030
If you enjoyed this discussion,704 00:45:46.170 --> 00:45:50.710 you may like to join us on either one of our in person courses here in Oxford 705 00:45:50.960 --> 00:45:53.150 or come on the, uh, 706 00:45:53.150 --> 00:45:56.910 six week introduction to fantasy writing course, 707 00:45:56.910 --> 00:46:01.070 which starts in October or even if you're further on in your writing journey, 708 00:46:01.250 --> 00:46:03.670 the novel in the year course. 709 00:46:03.670 --> 00:46:08.670 The next one of those starts in January do visit our website to find out 710 00:46:08.670 --> 00:46:10.830 more details. But for the moment, 711 00:46:11.030 --> 00:46:13.750 thank you very much for listening to myth makers. 712 00:46:21.440 --> 00:46:22.050
Thanks.713 00:46:22.050 --> 00:46:26.970
For listening to mythmakers podcast brought to you by the Oxford center714 00:46:26.970 --> 00:46:31.930 for fantasy visit Oxford center for fantasy.org to join in the 715 00:46:31.930 --> 00:46:32.640 fun. 716 00:46:32.640 --> 00:46:37.570 Find out about our online courses in person stays in Oxford plus 717 00:46:37.650 --> 00:46:39.930 visit our shop for great gifts. 718 00:46:40.360 --> 00:46:45.050 Tell a friend and subscribe wherever you find your favorite podcasts 719 00:46:45.130 --> 00:46:45.930 worldwide.
